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Don't stop believing - Journey
November 16, 2014
9:07 am
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quentin
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https://app.box.com/s/2q43d9qh3rm366ie5p4j

I posted a first attempt and got several comments that were really useful to improve my singing on this song.
I hope you will find this one carries more quality both in the singing and in the interpretation.

I took a free afternoon to do another take and ended up almost re-recording the song from scratch as i found my voice sounds way better now.
I am not really a light singer, more a chest puller who likes to belt and sing with a good deal of rasp, but it is refreshing to do something different from time to time.

I had the intent to work my ass off and sound as good as Phil on this cover, but i still feel when i hear both covers in a row that i need some extra skill to get there.
Nonetheless, i love the fact that in the end i can feel not just like doing a sub-par cover, but developping a tone of my own

I think this song will be on my YT channel after some modifications if necessary.

November 16, 2014
10:59 am
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TommyTheHat
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Great job on that quentin. I thought you sounded really good. The interpretation worked for me but I suppose that's a matter of taste. It becomes difficult with a song like this anyway because you don't want to alter the melody too much. This song is too identifiable. The singing was good. If I were listening as an audience listener I would be completely satisfied...nothing wrong with this presentation. If I were a nit picking vocal inspector (which I'm not) looking deeply for something to say then it would be the ending. I give you credit because I certainly couldn't do it. But if there were anything at all to work on for the future then "maybe" it would be to get just a tiny bit more oomph into the last notes (a little stronger). Just a little bit. I'm not certain but they may have sounded a little "H." What I mean is that I can song "ah, ah, ah" tight and closed or I can add too much air at the start of the notes which adds a sort of "h" sound haaa haaa haaa.
It wasn't bad sounding but perhaps something to strengthen in the future?

Really nice job man.

"It's not how many notes you know. It's what you do with them."

November 16, 2014
4:07 pm
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quentin
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Tommy,

You are right about getting more compression and intensity at the end. For the moment, it is a bit challenging to sing light but not too light. I also think about other spots in the song where i could give an extra push. I also wanted to avoid belting the whole song, which is what i normally end up doing when i bring my guitar and sing with friends

There was also a big slide at the end of the song, up to G5, but i removed it as it sounded too cheesy :D

Thanks for listening and commenting!

November 16, 2014
5:55 pm
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TommyTheHat
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I don't think belting and this song go together. Anyway, I wouldn't focus too much on getting too specific. In my personal opinion, I believe in learning techniques to help you along. To have a tool to aid you. Not something to lean on as a crutch or to focus on. Your singing should be free and flowing and not technique bound. I want to hear you "sing" I don't want to listen to your "technique." That's too sterile. "Work" on technique and then just "sing." Once technique is ingrained it should just happen. Just be. Good support and good freedom and control of the voice. This song requires control so as not to over sing it. You did well. You want to improve it and that's fine. Keep moving forward. But don't over think it. Find the heart of the song and the emotion involved and let it guide you. Then use your tools. Then just sing it . Sing it like you mean it man. Control it. Wink

"It's not how many notes you know. It's what you do with them."

November 16, 2014
6:57 pm
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OwenKorzec
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I think everything's good except you just need more twang so that your voice can cut through the instrumentation more easily and sound less muddy/woofy. Don't think of it as adding weight or compression but just making sure you maintain a kind of sparkley buzzy trebley high end in everything you do and don't let your vowel modifications take that away from you. The goal is to get both to coexist. Chiaroscuro. Brightness with darkness. You have the darkness nailed down and just growing the brightness will help a ton.

So talk to Phil about growing your bright ping more. You may have "enough" at the moment for technique/feeling purposes to get by, but I'm not hearing it. And it's so important in balancing out your tone. And I think in turn that will really help your notes in this song sound and feel less shouty and more released and also help your voice naturally cut right through to the front of the mix.

November 16, 2014
6:59 pm
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OwenKorzec
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Also, part of the trick to getting more of that brightness in the studio is singing closer to the mic, but I feel like it's probably 40% that and 60% a matter of training it stronger into your voice itself.

November 18, 2014
5:36 pm
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quentin
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Owen,

The mic thing probably plays a role because i have sung this song a lot of times in different instances (along with my guitar with friends, in karaoke clubs etc) and it didn't sound as muddy as when i record it with my condenser mic. I am feeling like losing frequencies or something. I usually stand 30 to 50 centimeters from the mic, which is placed a bit Under my mouth.

Regarding twang, i will definitly Schedule that with Phil because i feel this isn't just a mixed voice issue, but that i would also beneficiate of a little more brightness in my mid range. I can twang really hard during vocal exercices, but in songs, i tend to forget to keep the buzzing sound. When my voice is warmed up in the high range, i have more difficulties having a bright sound in my mid-lower range, and conversely, when i am not too much warmed up, i feel having a very rich low and mid range with a nice buzz (down to G2) while my mixed voice doesn't sound as good.

November 18, 2014
8:46 pm
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OwenKorzec
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quentin said

Owen,

The mic thing probably plays a role because i have sung this song a lot of times in different instances (along with my guitar with friends, in karaoke clubs etc) and it didn't sound as muddy as when i record it with my condenser mic. I am feeling like losing frequencies or something. I usually stand 30 to 50 centimeters from the mic, which is placed a bit Under my mouth.

Regarding twang, i will definitly Schedule that with Phil because i feel this isn't just a mixed voice issue, but that i would also beneficiate of a little more brightness in my mid range. I can twang really hard during vocal exercices, but in songs, i tend to forget to keep the buzzing sound. When my voice is warmed up in the high range, i have more difficulties having a bright sound in my mid-lower range, and conversely, when i am not too much warmed up, i feel having a very rich low and mid range with a nice buzz (down to G2) while my mixed voice doesn't sound as good.

30-50 centimeters is waaaay too far back dude! (for most situations) Turn down your gain so that it doesn't peak when you are close to the mic, and then sing from around 10-20 cm away. Also place the mic in line with your mouth not under it. Both of these adjustments will reveal a lot more of what's in the high frequencies of your voice, be it airiness or good closure. Either way, having those high frequencies picked up more carefully by recording closer, will help a vocal sit better in the mix.

November 18, 2014
9:23 pm
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Phil Moufarrege
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You sound great dude! Best I've heard you on this.
THe only comments I have is that delay effect is too strong and the harmonies are out but your actual singing rocks dude!
I have a feeling the muddiness is mostly the recording..I would like to have a look and see though. Send me the raw vocal to me Quentin and I will have a look.

@PhilMoufarrege
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Grow-The-Voice.com | PHILMOUFARREGE.com

November 18, 2014
11:22 pm
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Phil Moufarrege
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OwenKorzec said

quentin said

Owen,

The mic thing probably plays a role because i have sung this song a lot of times in different instances (along with my guitar with friends, in karaoke clubs etc) and it didn't sound as muddy as when i record it with my condenser mic. I am feeling like losing frequencies or something. I usually stand 30 to 50 centimeters from the mic, which is placed a bit Under my mouth.

Regarding twang, i will definitly Schedule that with Phil because i feel this isn't just a mixed voice issue, but that i would also beneficiate of a little more brightness in my mid range. I can twang really hard during vocal exercices, but in songs, i tend to forget to keep the buzzing sound. When my voice is warmed up in the high range, i have more difficulties having a bright sound in my mid-lower range, and conversely, when i am not too much warmed up, i feel having a very rich low and mid range with a nice buzz (down to G2) while my mixed voice doesn't sound as good.

30-50 centimeters is waaaay too far back dude! (for most situations) Turn down your gain so that it doesn't peak when you are close to the mic, and then sing from around 10-20 cm away. Also place the mic in line with your mouth not under it. Both of these adjustments will reveal a lot more of what's in the high frequencies of your voice, be it airiness or good closure. Either way, having those high frequencies picked up more carefully by recording closer, will help a vocal sit better in the mix.

good post by Owen...I think these will fix the problems..but still wouldn't mind hearing it raw for myself , send it over!

@PhilMoufarrege
Online Vocal Coach, Singer/Songwriter
Grow-The-Voice.com | PHILMOUFARREGE.com

November 23, 2014
10:08 am
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Sexy Beast
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I like it Quentin!

Only critique is I'd like to hear those B4's and above a little chestier. But I don't have to be right haha. Also you seem to be loosing some brightness or ping in your higher range, that's B4+ as well.

Is this one take?

November 23, 2014
1:37 pm
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quentin
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Hello Sexy Beast,

Thanks for the feed back

I usually do one take for the verses, and one for the choruses. But in this song, there is still room for improvement. About the brightness, it is apparently a sound mixing issue. I had Phil remix it, and it sounds way brighter and less muddy.

You are right about the higher notes being too light. I rehearsed yesterday trying to add more weigth and it sounded more operatic. I think i will lay down another attempt soon :-)

November 23, 2014
3:46 pm
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Sexy Beast
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Hey Quentin, I'm not talking about the mudyness of the recording... I hear that. It's just your tone is a little inconsistent from bottom to top. There is a disconnect. But I'm really being picky here. Most people would say it sounds just fine!

Looking forward to the new version Smile

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