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The "How does he/she do it?" Thread
October 8, 2014
5:11 am
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Ugi
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I guess every vocal forum needs a thread like that :)

Since I'm rather new to real vocal development my first question is quite unspecified - a newbie-question, sorry for that.

My favourite singer and vocal idol is Power Metal singer Jioti Parcharidis who recorded two outstanding albums with the band Human Fortress.

You can listen to his skills here:

My simple question is: Is he singing in full voice when he's going high (like at 00.38)? Or at the end of the chorus at 00.56?

I really love his timbre in his higher range, it sounds so clean.

"The separate self is not an entity; it is an activity: the activity of thinking and feeling that our essential nature of pure Awareness shares the limits and the destiny of the body and mind." - Rupert Spira

October 8, 2014
1:37 pm
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OwenKorzec
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Maybe this thread could be a sticky?

I would kill to be able to sing like this: very light while somehow sounding like he is still "connected to the chest" most of the time.

Interesting that he doesn't sing this song live, maybe it's really difficult for him too? His whole vocal style is like this almost all the time though so I doubt that is the reason

October 8, 2014
5:23 pm
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TommyTheHat
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I am comfortable in believing that some things are just personal abilities that may not be attainable by every singer. Some things are technique. Others are just personal traits.
In the video I am providing here I would give anything to be able to sing it. I can pretty much manage the whole song other than the ending but the ending , to me, is what makes this and I have dreams of the crowd getting on their feet when I sing the ending. But I have also faced the fact that this is what "HE" does and not what I will ever be able to do. I'm comfortable with that. Check out from about 4:40 till the end. I know this isn't every ones taste, but it's mine. This stuff gives me chills!!

"It's not how many notes you know. It's what you do with them."

October 8, 2014
10:41 pm
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Phil Moufarrege
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Ugi said

My simple question is: Is he singing in full voice when he's going high (like at 00.38)? Or at the end of the chorus at 00.56?

I really love his timbre in his higher range, it sounds so clean.

Yes he is in full voice. To get closer to this timbre, practicing with a nice bright ping, keeping the sound "vertical" meaning his vowels aren't wide, and paying attention to shifting resonance with good finesse so that there is no strain in the sound is what will get you closer to this sound. He is keeping a lot of restraint on it (glottal compression) which gives it that "laser-like" "focused" quality.

Everything I have been showing you in the lessons will get you closer to this sound.

@PhilMoufarrege
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October 9, 2014
8:28 am
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Justin Chew
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How did Adam manage the maintain the tone of his chest voice up to the top of his range. Tons of rock singers i see, their top notes don't sound anything like their chest voice but Adam sounds the same to the top and it is a Bb5!!! That is stinking high.

Secondly, why does he stick his tongue out when he belts? I got into an argument with a vocal "Guru" on youtube called Primohomme who claims he can belt out D6(a dude) and that Adam Strains? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do-fPSEF9do). However, Adam's upper register seems extremely flexible considering he can belt an F5 on the dot without needing to slide up through the passagio

Thirdly, does Adam Bridge late?

Lastly, i know this is stupid but, with his current technique, can he still sing when he reaches his 50s or 60s. Steven Tyler can so can Adam do so?

October 9, 2014
11:02 pm
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OwenKorzec
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that vocal guru doesn't sound like a guru to me just a dude who can squeak out some really high and low stuff. what he said was mixed voice was actually falsetto, and he's claiming D3-F4 is the core of the male voice (nope C3-A4 should be a really strong core if you're serious)...based on those two bits alone he seems like an SLS dude who couldn't belt out a rock tune if his life depended on it.

He's probably saying Adam is straining because he's been taught incorrectly that anything about speech volume or that takes some kind of effort is strain...

Adam sticks his tongue out when he belts because that is often actually the most optimal tongue position - it opens the throat the most especially if you have a long tongue. Not sure why it's rarely used, maybe because it's an added variable that could be hard to reign in and control if you're not careful. I've had coaches recommend it to me at times but never a permanent thing. I suppose it has its pros and cons.

He does bridge late.

I predict Adam's voice will be doing very well in old age, actually probably much better than Steven Tyler who abused his voice with drugs, screaming, etc.

October 10, 2014
1:11 am
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Phil Moufarrege
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Great post by Owen.

that "primohomo" guy is a funny character to say the least. I've seen him arguing with others on the internet before. Anyone who sings louder than a whisper is straining according to him. He reminds me of those guys that get fixated on squeaking out a few whistle notes but never actually sing anything....would love to hear him try to sing any of Adam Lamberts songs in full voice (or any other song that goes above F4 and is louder than speaking volume - hint: almost every song).

When he sticks under F4 he can sing quite well, but notice he never touches anything from G4-C5 in songs.

All the "range demonstrations" are like brett mannings...skipping the passagio and just doing squeaks.

"and he's claiming D3-F4 is the core of the male voice "
Haha, that is the range i STARTED with and my song choices were EXTREMELY LIMITED. Almost every song goes above F4 in full voice.

"He's probably saying Adam is straining because he's been taught incorrectly that anything about speech volume or that takes some kind of effort is strain..."

That is exactly the mindset I bet he has as many of the people on the Singing Success forums have. The keyboard warriors (with no clips of themselves singing) on there believe that if you stay connected above an F4 then you're "straining".

Adam Lambert is a seriously good singer and his technique as far as I'm concerned is very good. Steven Tyler I wouldn't say has good technique (although I love his voice and singing)...Adam most certainly will most likely retain his voice as long as he desires... as long as he doesn't abuse it (abuse to me is defined as continuing to sing when your voice clearly needs to rest).

@PhilMoufarrege
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October 10, 2014
6:45 am
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Justin Chew
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Another thing about this guy, he says he has more head voice in his mix and the Ab4!!! And that if he tries to bring up his chest voice into his mix above C5, it would damage his voice as his voice type is to heavy which is funny when baritones like chris Cornell and low tenors like Ronnie James Dio have been doing that for his entire life?

The only question that has been unanswered is that how Adam retains a consistent tone up to the top of his range?

October 10, 2014
8:49 am
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Phil Moufarrege
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Justin Chew said

The only question that has been unanswered is that how Adam retains a consistent tone up to the top of his range?

through training

@PhilMoufarrege
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October 10, 2014
10:37 am
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wabba_treads420
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I love these kinds of threads! Awesome idea. Anyways, here's a really cool vocal range compilation video a friend of mine did that showcases Bruce Dickinson.

Ok, it sounds like Bruce Dickinson has built up a massive powerful chest voice range over the years and knows how to mix it with his head voice WAY up there (G#5 sounds like his transition point to pure head voice). Would you call his singing like the E5s in "Run to the hills" and "Where Eagles Dare" more of a chest resonant sound, as opposed to the Ian Gillan -like wails on his extreme highs like in "Number of The Beast". He is one of the few NWOBHM singers to maintain his style throughout the years. Is it because he never neglected his chest voice that hes kept on nailing his difficult material better than ever nowadays?

If you wanted to learn how to sing this way, should you focus on doing both heavy chest workouts + the head voice strengthening workouts all at once?

October 10, 2014
5:14 pm
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OwenKorzec
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The funny thing is effortless singing is a paradox. I was experimenting with it the other day just for fun...this idea of trying to sing as lazy as possible. And suddenly, just due to enacting that mentality, I started straining on D#4 again along with a whole bunch of other problems...

The practice of avoiding strain is one of the worst ideas to ever hit vocal pedagogy IMO. The correct mentality is to learn how to not AVOID strain but OVERCOME it through GRADUALLY adjusting HOW you create sound to become more and more efficient over time. Maybe a coach can rephrase that for me a little better, that's just currently the best way I can think of describing it.

But most importantly and fundamentally, if you own up to the acceptance of necessary tension in vocal phonation, your voice will actually open up, relieve some extraneous tensions, and feel and sound LESS strained overall despite higher pitches and greater power. It may feel like you are giving more physical effort, but the quality of sound is an exponential reward due to that added effort which is in reality simply more like the sensation of getting off your ass rather than the sensation of being strangled. For me personally, the mental goal of eliminating all tension, leads to the unpleasant physical result of feeling like my voice is victimized, out of control, being strangled, and definitely heavily encumbered by unwanted tension - because there is no more anchoring or controlling, you're just letting it all go to form its own chaotic setup and at that point, it's like the Soviet Russia jokes, now your voice controls you, not you controlling your voice. So that's why "effortless" singing is the biggest scam of the universe.

Again maybe a coach can explain this better.

October 10, 2014
8:25 pm
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Justin Chew
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I think Bruce mixes up all to the Bb5 or B5. The A5 from Number of the Beast sounds very chesty and heavy. His Bb5 notes have some hint of chest albeit very little though.

He does not really use head voice because his timbre would have a change in sound like Rob Halford who has a lighter and more agile range from the A5 to c#6 because he uses head voice from there on.

Singers like Glenn Hughes and Bruce here have very light sounding mixes up to A5s and B5s which make people think they have switched to head voice but on fact they are lightening up without losing.their timbre.

That happens to me when my notes in the top of my mix (G5 to C6 have a slightly lighter, less heavy sound but retains the same timbre and is not too light) This is because you can't really bring up all the weight and only the best have been able to bring up weight

Bruce is still singing as well because he developed his chest register before developing head. Ken Tamplin told me that if you neglect your chest. Your chest, mix and head voice will atrophy in time like Rob Halford

Bruce is able to being up his chest to B4 without mixing and when he does, he uses sound pharyngeal resonance so it retains a.thick tone without being shouty, too chesty and is able to retain agility.

Bruce goes to show that if you strengthen your chest voice, you will retain your voice and that heavy singers(Bruce is a low tenor which is closer to the high baritone male voice types which are more common) can bring up weight without straining or being overly chesty.

One of the Best vocalists to ever walk the planet

October 10, 2014
8:44 pm
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Phil Moufarrege
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Justin Chew said
That happens to me when my notes in the top of my mix (G5 to C6 have a slightly lighter, less heavy sound but retains the same timbre and is not too light) This is because you can't really bring up all the weight and only the best have been able to bring up weight

Last time I heard you (about 2 months ago) you were sending me extremely breathy and falsetto clips. Not full voice. Would love to hear your progress

@PhilMoufarrege
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October 10, 2014
9:10 pm
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Justin Chew
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I'll try, my phone's.recorder does not working my computer is spoilt

October 10, 2014
9:41 pm
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wabba_treads420
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Hmm cool posts guys! Ditto @ Owen

Ok now that I have more of an ear for evaluating different vocal techniques, I gave "Number of the Beast" and even the song "Gangland" a listen and now that you mention it Justin, I do hear he still hasn't lost his chest resonance there! I meant he STARTS to slowly hand off to head voice and mix more around G#5-B5. Even on the lighter mass cleaner styles like "Thin line between Love And Hate" he still maintained a strong supported chesty sound but in a lighter sound color. That takes a lot of training and coordination right there!

Rob Halford had a lot going on in Judas Priest stylistically. In "Dreamer Deceiver" he had a really clean, piercing almost bell-like head voice tones. In the 70's Rob seemed to use a lot more light mass head voice singing like this.

This song encapsulates all the sound colors he would use (a slightly raised larynx sneer and twang/mask, some rasp, and the wide vibrato) later in his career.

Heres another cool range video that lays out all the styles Rob did through the years. To me, he never fully started to even develop his chest voice until mid-to late 80's/early 90s.

October 10, 2014
9:45 pm
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Justin Chew
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You know what is the best thing about Bruce? He has nevery had formal coaching. He used to emulate ian gillan alot

October 10, 2014
9:53 pm
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wabba_treads420
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....xsSVNhyiKk

Fast-forward to 1980-1984. It sounds like he is now getting more of a mixed voice sound and his overall style is getting grittier.

October 10, 2014
9:55 pm
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wabba_treads420
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Justin Chew said

You know what is the best thing about Bruce? He has nevery had formal coaching. He used to emulate ian gillan alot

Yeah, Bruce is proof that learning to sing self-taught is definitely possible. Bruce sounds A LOT like Ian Gillan the higher in his range he goes. Its uncanny...

October 10, 2014
9:57 pm
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Justin Chew
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I honestly feel that Rob Halford can't compete with Bruce considering that he could not even sing lots of Black Sabbath stuff

October 10, 2014
10:05 pm
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wabba_treads420
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Rob Halford is one of my favorite singers of all time, but unfortunately this performance is proof of what may happen if your don't work out ALL parts of your voice (in Rob's case, his chest resonance).

Kind of off-topic but he kind of sounds like Frieza from Dragon Ball Z here. Laugh

He seems to be struggling in the chorus parts and the bridge leading up to the awesome A5 (brighter than a thousand suns part) In the studio version he mixes but since his chest voice has atrophied there is only head voice left and it sounds strange. Still, major props for still singing this when hes 60+ one of the most demanding songs ever...

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